please note - reviews on this site are purely the opinion of site visitors, so don't take them too seriously.
It's mostly clean now and the toilets aren't flooded with piss, which is a bonus. Still does snake - bite and black at the bar at a reasonable price too. Music can be on the questionable side - depends when you're there. Daytime it can be virtually deserted, evenings it can get very busy. Better than it was a few years back, but still not great. Mind you, most of the pubs in Camden are over priced, overcrowded tourist magnets and the Dev/Hobgoblin certainly isn't, so a win there.
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Still the same (metal-orientated) incarnation, but last night after coming from a really good death metal gig, they were playing cheesy stuff like 50s rock n roll, then progressed to cheesy classic rock / party rock, which can be forgiven due to it being a Saturday night and party night - and good metal being a bit serious and technical.
However, beware the cheese that can be played by the glam-rock loving red-haired DJ. Who's OK as a person, all else being equal, but really does love his 80s pop-metal and plain POP a bit too much. If you don't want to play metal, or something at least impossible to hear in mine or any other local, move over and allow new blood in, mate.
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How much you appreciate the pub rather depends on what sort of a night out you want. If you're used to metal pubs such as the Intrepid Fox, then this will be right up your street. The music is variable - I've been in on a Sunday afternoon and it's been pretty chilled, and everything at a reasonable volume, and I've also been in on a Sunday afternoon and had to shout over the top of skull-splittingly loud death metal. But if you go in at a busy time - Friday or Saturday night, then it will be loud.
Regularly have DJs and bands, and the overall vibe is not bad, though it's quite small and fills up quite quickly. The toilets are possibly the worst in London, but the Newcastle is cold, the Hob is pretty well kept, and to be honest, the clientel aren't the type to be put off by the state of the bogs. The bar staff are variable - I've had great service, and I've stood ignored for what seemed like hours while the dozy barmaid chatted to one of her mates and the punters got increasingly riled. I don't go in that often, and don't recognise the staff from one visit to the next, so suspect that there is a fair turn over of employees.
A great metal pub in the heart of Camden
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I was forced to take a dump here and I can honestly say it has scared me for life!!! Terrible place
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Metal dive bar frequented by rockers and the odd Camden punk. I recognise a few refugees from the old Intrepid Fox.
The beer's not great, but most people drink snakebite or Guiness anyway. Toilets are awful and it's dead in the daytime, but if you want to listen to metal and watch the freaks it's as good a place as any. Also has occasional live music (not big names, but I think it's free).
One other comment. Sack the DJ. The music is usually better before he turns up !
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Went to a gig in the area recently and got dragged back to The Hobgoblin [aka The Dev] against my better judgement. It's gone even further downhill in terms of stink, filth and loitering street-drinkers. The staff are still a bunch of up themselves w*****s. The crusty, urine stinking, alcoholics with dogs on string are even more numerous now and hang around you waiting to steal your beer as soon as you blink. The council should shut the loserville Dev down and do Camden a favour. Its a waste of good space all round. Vile.
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For cleanliness etc.....dont bother
For atmosphere and a bloody good few jars with some of the most laid back people....Bother
Great place
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A footnote to the last comment- the toilets have ALWAYS been terrible in the Dev haven't they? I've been going there on and off for well over fifteen years.
Anyway yes it has changed, not sure whether for better or worse really. Not sure at all about the porn pictures all over the tables- a bit schoolboy / childish. Drinks are ok. Toilets utterly vile. Luckily the Dev doesn't do food (to my knowledge). Music always very good.
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Hii, ok I used to go to this pub all the time years ago and I loved it, one of my favourite places to go to in London, it had random, alternative art decor, good tunes etc and the mannequinn and cobwebbed iron at the back was pretty cool and helped add to the atmosphere. Since it has changed hands and become 'the hobgoblin' it seems to have become some kind of metal bar, which is cool and I`m glad that it`s still alternative. However, the place appears to be going down hill. Each time I`ve gone in there which has been fleetingly now these last couple of years, the place seems to get dirtier and dirtier, so much so that the last time I went there and happened to take with me some non londoner friends to the show them the dev and chill out, we had one drink and left. The tables were sticky and filthy, the floor was a state, the whole place seems to have let itself go - and I doubt theres any point mentioning the hideous toilets - utterly gross. Perhaps my mistake was going in there in the daytime on my last visit?
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good music, bad ale.
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Surprisingly good pint of Guinness.
Not my first choice for a drinking den, but never regeret going in here either
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A.K.A. the Hobgoblin, the Devonshire is basically a rock / goth / indie pub along the lines of the Intrepid Fox but with a far more battered and grubby appearance. Battered furnishings, black walls and a thousand and one posters of Marilyn Mansun eyeballing you from every angle won�t be everyone�s cup of tea and the fake cobwebs and gothic fake flickering lighting is more London Dungeon than trendy Camden. You almost expect a rubber spider to crawl out of a crack in the floor. 3 hand pumps but all off on my visit � Hobgoblin seems to be the only ale that they do but I had to resort to Guinness which was a lucky choice as it was during happy hour (that seems to last 3 days) where selected �beers� are all �2.20. A raised corner doubles up as a stage for live bands and there is a DJ stall which presumably pumps out a diet of AC/DC at ear shattering volume when the need arises. Not sure how this place has missed my radar for so long but I do like a good grubby venue now and again and I need to return at some point as I sadly missed out on the toilet experience.
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I prefered this place when I went sometime this Spring to circa 2003 when the guy behind the bar, who looked like Herman Munster kept staring at me whilst the best of Bauhaus meandered on in the background.
A pretty decent place to stop off for quick pint or two before a gig at the Underworld. Anything rather than the mind numbing tedium of the Worlds End..
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Am I the only person who wishes they would just put the Dev (anyone who ever went there regularly will never recognise it as the Hobgoblin) out of it's misery and refurbish and re-launch it as a yuppy wine bar/gastro pub.
Its like watching an old friend die slowly of cancer. The Dev was a wonderful place years ago, and I have spent many a happy night there but regular changes of management are not doing anything new with it, and the 'dive rock bar' concept isn't working.
The place is either empty or full of people who are not spending money and really could use a shower. That might match the edgy atmosphere aims of consecutive managers but its not providing a living for anyone.
I will agree that the goth only door policy of a few years ago was a step too far, but anyone can see that the rock bar concept isn't working either. Nor can it seemingly provide enough punters through the door to sustain its profits.
People who want an alternative bar, go to Big Red where the music is great, the beer selection is fine (personally would love to see some real ales on but hey you can't have everything), the food is wholesome and the mix of people makes for a lively atmosphere.
Compare that to the Dev where the bar looks filthy there is never a full range of beers (god knows how long some of the stock has been sitting in the cellar), and ice is something that has been forgotten. I mean where are you going to choose to sample your adult beverage of choice? Seriously.
Enough already, close it and let someone else try something new with it. They might even hit on a good idea that makes them money.
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I made my 3rd and last visit to the Dev under its latest manager and I wont be going again until she's out of there and its had a good clean. I wont go into a massive amount of detail, but running out of beer at 9.30 on a Saturday really isn't a way to run a pub. Last time I went they'd run out of glasses and the girl behind the bar (Who used to be a security guard and now seems to spend most of her time doing her long hair behind the bar) was busy adjusting her ill fitting clothing rather than serving. When she did finally decide to do some work, I got a hoegaarden that smelt like rotten egg and my husbands ale was 3/4 full -when I asked POLITELY could she perhaps top it up she basically pulled the pump so hard I thought it was going to fall off the bar and then slammed the glass down so viciously i'm amazed it didn't break. So that was service with a smile Dev style.
Also the toilets - my husband said the same urinal has been broken in the mens for weeks wit the same festering bucket of god only knows what gathering underneath the leak. He has been in a zillion portaloos at festivals and said nothing compared to the stench in the Dev. I can believe this as I saw more used ladies sanitary products in the toilet than I ever need to see again. Would it kill them to clean?
As for the manageress - she's a joke. When I asked her on my husbands 40th (my first visit under her "management") were they going to be serving any more beer as they'd run out her answer was along the lines of "i've made my money for the night (at 9.30) and couldnt give a s**t)
Finally - another poster mentioned the punks- when the punks run the Dev it was cleaner and a lot more welcoming than it is now. We went on NYE and it was mainly punk bar staff, yeah they were drunk and maybe a little whiffy but they served you quickly and without attitude. And the music was better when they were in charge too. And it was cleaner. I dont know how it survives now- I'd have assumed the state of the place breaks about a zillion health violations!
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Any pub that has a Front 242 Poster over the bar area has to be fab regardless of what anyone else says or thinks.....
cufc4 - 20 Jul 2009 11:13 |
The penultimate port of crawl before the Manics saw us end up here. OK, we didn�t just end up here, we deliberately chose this place because � thanks to the reviews on BITE � we wanted to see just how awful the toilets were. Gentlemen (and Ladies, we checked) this place lives up to the hype. They are the worst pub toilets I�ve yet to experience; Michael Eavis would veto them if they appeared on Worthy Farm.
On the pub side, the inside is loud, dark and scruffy. One bonus was the ale � the Hobgoblin was decently priced for the area and tasted fairly good given some of the soup/Sarsons I�d been subjected to earlier.
Worth a stop for the comedy value � once. Or twice if you use the toilets as a forfeit for a bet.
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Definitely less pretentious than when it was The Dev but still not somewhere you'd go when you're sober. Popped in one Saturday to find about 10 people in the bar and over 30 outside, due to the ear-splitting music inside. Rockers aren't exactly scared of loud music but Europe at full volume when you're trying to chat is a bit mental. Bar staff are disinterested at best. Grubby toilets are expected in Camden but the loos here are in a league of their own!
anonymous - 20 May 2009 21:30 |
The bar has just changed management - again. The homeless pish-stinking elderly oi-punks who were previously banned have been let back in and were in full aggressive mode. It took forever to get served and while I was waiting, a total skank with a dog on a bit of string swaggered up to the bar and harangued me to buy her a drink. She got abusive when I refused. The pint glasses served up to me were filthy. Two friends had their drinks roofied with rohypnol under the old management last year and got violently robbed. Things have got worse now. The rancid toilets are the least of your worries in this hellhole. If you really HAVE to go to The Dev (why?), buy a bottled beer (clean) and keep your thumb in it (safe).
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Visted on a recent trip from Sydney. Great music if you like loud heavy rock. Toilets were disgusting but that is usually expected (World's End was far worse). Staff were friendly and the beer (bottled Hobgoblin ) was great. Had a sore head the next day...not sure if is was the music or the beer....
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Dark, dank, the worst men's loo since "Trainspotting", shite music, BUT - if you wanna get hammered quickly, talk bollox for England, get chatted up by alluring goths half your age, wink at friendly barmaids who know who's first and remember what you're drinking - get in there!
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There seems to have been some issue with the door policy at this place in the past, but I am glad to say that on Friday night I strolled in past the bouncers wearing my white Reebok Classics, blue jeans and brown jacket with no problem. In fact one of the bouncers actually engaged me conversation.
The barmaid was very friendly and my pint of Stella was on good form. Unfortunately the actual pub is a dank crap hole that blares out brain damage music that my feeble council estate brain is not accustomed too.
Although the welcome was friendly this place is not my cup of tea at all so I�ll continue drinking in my local whilst watching Sky Sports and hanging off Jeff Stelling�s every word.
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The Devonshire Arms is now the Hobgoblin. It's just grim now.
The tables were originally recovered with some kind of anime characters which peeled off and have now been re-recovered with phone-box porn. Most nights it's too loud in there to have a conversation; various kinds of metal being played at high volume so half the pub sits out the front. The (men's) toilets have fallen into a completely unclean state, doesn't look like they've been cleaned since the handover - there was a guy urinating in the sink when I went in there, but given the state of it I wouldn't want to wash my hands in it. The bar staff don't really seem to care about any kind of service. The beer was ok though.
Shame really. It seems to have really headed rapidly downhill since the changeover a few months ago.
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Goths, punks and weirdo�s galore. Welcome then, to the Devonshire Arms. Loud thrash metal blaring; pierced punks perched on bar-side stools, tables decorated with movie flyers and a garish purple and black colour scheme. The toilets are disgusting. This is, most definitely not, a pub for the faint hearted. However, this reviewer enjoyed his experience within. Yes, here may scare some, but for us open-minded souls, places like this are too much a curiosity, not to be explored. The gentleman behind the bar was friendly and the Hobgoblin ale (�3.05) tasted as it should. The glass was reassuringly dirty � sorry, that last part is a lie. Here also plays host to live bands on selected nights. Personally, I feel a trip to Camden would be incomplete without a stop here.
HTM69 - 19 Sep 2008 18:44 |
Been to this pub a few times recently & seriously unimpressed. Constant loud metal, death metal and punk covers of metal songs played at high volume - no variety, no Goth or Industrial music and the SAME songs played over and over and over. Last time I was there heard Metallica's "So What" 3 times - which is too many by anyone's standards. The pub was nearly deserted, the doors wide open so it was freezing cold, and the decor just plain dull - toilets were unpleasant. There was one group of decently dressed punks - who had clearly made an effort - however, they left after one round of drinks. No-one who came in stayed for long and personally can't blame them. I like a pub to have character, interesting people and good music - sadly I found none of these at the Dev.
On the bright side - beer not too expensive, decently poured pint and not far from the tube/bus stops. So will probably pop in for a quick one every now and again, but not a pub to spend any great length of time in.
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Psychonaut - your right, i have no idea why it changed ownership, and i never said i did.
Also, i said i 'see' it is now called the Hobgoblin, which is what it does say in big writing on the outside. As i said i wasn't allowed in last time i went (2 years ago) so how would i know what it said above the door 2 weeks ago?
As for my attitude, if walking up to a pub door constitutes attitude, i should be banned from everywhere. However, the Dev/Hob was the last place i ever got kicked out of.
The reason i said it had dissappeared up its own backside was because a pub that i had been in about 10 times a year since the 80's suddenly won't serve me cos its to cool/i'm not cool enough.......what should i think?
I never slagged the set up of the pub, music,drinks or customers, who are some of the better Camden pub people, just the policy.
So, if someone who isn't as easily offended as Psychonaut could answer me, is it less elitest/prejudice now.
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conflictuk, you obviously have no clue as to why The Dev changed ownership. This is obvious from your stupid little parting jibe. It did not "disappear up it's own backside".
And I'm sure the sign above the door still said The Devonshire Arms, not Hobgoblin, when I was there at the weekend.
Perhaps not getting served had something to do with your general attitude.
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i used to go to this pub in the 80's/90's and it was always a pretty good pub, gradually getting more goth as the years passed by. What got me about 2 years ago was that i wasn't allowed in due to the fact i had a pair of trainers on!! I was a punk in my teens,20's and 30's, when i used to get strange looks of the staff of the Dev and not served in alot of pubs because of the way i looked, as well as a continual threat of violence. I truely resented not being served by some uber goth in a little bit of eyeliner and white make up because i obviously can't like that scene because i don't dress like a nob. I see it's now called the Hobgoblin, is it less elitest/prejudice now? It's a shame when somewhere that was cool dissappears up it's own backside
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dark, dirty, foreboding. Loved it! Hobgoblin in good shape. No bloody tourists. Wonderful.
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A classic pub of the nineties. Always Goth oriented, the Cure and All About Eve adorned the jukebox, but so did the Prodigy and the Wolfhounds. Then, the management opted for a bit of ethnic cleansing just as all the decent Goth music died a death. So, the music of johnny come latelys like Marilyn Manson was deemed superior to the eclecticism of yesteryear. Other reviews here indicate that the policy has been relaxed - back to open mindedness for one of the capital's more singular pubs.
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Not been for ages but always a place i pop into for a pint or two while cd shopping in RR.
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Paid brief visit today at 1345 to sample the cask ale; can report the following:
1 cask ale - Hobgoblin, available @ �3/pint.
Condition - Reasonable.
Unfortunately this was served in a very warm glass. I would estimate the glass temperature was 35C and was straight from the dishwasher. It would be well worth asking for a cold glass when ordering beer.
The pub has a more spacious feel to its interior, and is a bit brighter by day than it was previously.
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I have to say I'm surprised at all the positive reviews of the 'new' Dev... I went in there for the first time in ages and was taken aback by how much worse the atmosphere was. The bar staff ignored me and my friend at the bar for ages too, even leaning over my shoulder to ask their friend who had just approached the bar what she wanted to drink! Maybe I just went in on a bad night because the atmosphere was so much worse than usual I'm not keen to go back (and it used to be one of my favourite pubs in London). Was I unlucky, or have any other previous Dev regulars had a bad experience there lately?
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First time in this pub for over twenty years.
It was ok as it goes, decent geezer running the place(who admitted to me he'd lost loads of customers since doing away with the goths only rule) Its still a goth pub, but more relaxed on the door rules.
Music wasnt too bad,and the ammount of clevage on display was truelly breathtaking :)
Probably wont become me local, but another one to add to the list
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Now owned by the Hobgoblin group and has three cask ales available.
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So its not just Goth only anymore?! Might give this a go one night, as i pass it most Sundays on me way to the Elephants head
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Went to the "new" Dev on Thursday before a gig after hearing it had real ale and such goodies now - and it was great. The bar staff were really friendly which wasn't always the case before. There is a better range of beer, including Hoegaarden on draft and some real ales - which my husband said were all really well kept.
Now if only they'd sort out the loos it would be perfect!!!!
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Yes, The Dev has been taken over by metallers but quite sensibly they have not made it a 'metal' pub. It's an 'alternative' pub. The goths have not been kicked out, they and everyone else are welcome. Whether they carry on frequenting it or go off in a huff at the loss of the goth exclusivity I don't know but if the latter then it's no loss. Speaking as a goffik type myself I think the place has really benefitted from the change. They've swept away all the crap decor, given it a lick of paint and even (gasp!), cleaned it. So much livelier and friendly now as well. I used to go to The Elephant's Head more as I preferred the friendly mix there and no cliquey scene. I'm certainly going to be going to The Dev more now.
You can even buy ale!!!
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"fraudulent, pantomine youth cultutre, pretend danger and very, very un rock and roll"
Well said Sir!
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The Goths apparently been kicked out and the new management have turned the Dev into a Metal pub. The bizarre sculptures have been replaced with JD and Jagermiester flags and the place overall seems so much more lively. If you can imagine that. Recommended...
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I think it's long overdue that the Dev decided to grow up and welcome everyone into its pale faced busom. Goth dress code...ridiculous, if its not careful it will end up a plastic signed, pub in a box (maybe even flock wallpaper) i think that wot the chains are all doing now.
keeping morons out of boozers is right but not at the cost of the greater good of the pub and black only dress code.
anonymous - 21 Sep 2007 22:39 |
The Devonshire Arms is less than five minutes walk from Camden Town underground station, in the general direction of Kentish Town. It is not particularly large. The selection of drinks is not particularly wide, and the prices are fairly average for London. The bar staff are variable - they can be attentive, or can often be not so good. The floors are not very clean, and the whole place looks a bit dingy and worn. The toilets are very grotty indeed. The pub does not sell hot food. The volume levels can be high in the evenings. The ambience is enhanced by low light levels that disguise the state of the d�cor.
There is a lot of decoration in the style of modern Gothic memorabilia/bricolage. Band posters cover the ceiling. There is a broomstick, a plastic skeleton, a skull, a spider web, etc. forming a busy pile of random dark stuff. A sign behind the bar reads "No football colours".
The Dev is an Goth/alternative bar, probably more so than any other bar in London. The Dev is not just frequented by Goths , the pub has a dress code to that effect: strictly no football kit, alternative dress preferred. They always have people at the door to guard entry. Indeed, this door policy is the pub's unique selling point. However it's not that hard to get in if you are that way inclined - jeans and a t-shirt will do so long as they are in basic black. Some people inside will be very dressed up, but not everyone. The dress code is more likely to be relaxed during the day when the pub is relatively empty. Resident DJs play some evenings, live bands some Thursdays.
The Dev's patrons do not in general go to the Dev because it sells beer. Beer can be had at a multitude of pubs and off-licences in London, many nearby. They go to The Dev because that scene is what they want. They know for certain they won't be hassled about their look there, though the odds of that happening elsewhere in a Camden pub must be quite low anyway. If you don't like it, then there are many other pubs in Camden that you might like more. If you are into wearing too much black, it's a very well-known place, and it's worth going to see it at least once.
When you want some interesting beers, exit the Dev, walk five minutes Northish (away from Camden tube) on Kentish Town road, over the canal and under the railway, until you come to a blue-painted bar called Quinn's. Ignore the sports on TV and the dodgy people in the front, try the guest ale, a bottled beer or a fruit beer; and sit at the back. There's lots of room, it's cleaner and they also have basic bar food.
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Operates a 'Gothic only' dress code even on a quiet Saturday afternoon. If I'd been dressed in my usual black T shirt and jeans instead of like a reject from Miami Vice I wonder if I'd have been allowed in. I hope so.
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"two of the girls weren't dressed in black jumpers, red and black laddered tights, cheap market DM's, badly applied makeup and a 'Nightmare Before Xmas' PVC bag"
Hmm, I don't recall seeing many of the women who visit The Dev dressed like this. Plenty of interesting and varied customers to be found whenever I go. Nothing fraudulent about any of them, as far as I've noticed.
Get a sense of bitterness in your post, anonymous. Would you try to dine at a 'collar and tie' restaurant in a rugby shirt?
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It is true this pub is slowly dying due to its 'uniform' policy, not dress code. Uniform as in its become the Eton of the Goth scene, narrow minded and snobbish and you have to don the stereotyped attire to convince the staff you should be served. The establishment promotes itself as an 'alternative' pub and you would think this lent itself across a varied and wide section but alas no. What is means is their stereotyped GOTH pub and the evidence was sadly witnessed by many 2 weeks ago when a party of people were refused to be served as two of the girls weren't dressed in black jumpers, red and black laddered tights, cheap market DM's, badly applied makeup and a 'Nightmare Before Xmas' PVC bag. It would appear jealousy and insecurity run very deep within the veins of its staff and punters. It was ironic that the party refused to be served were long standing promoters within the goth/festish/gay/alternitive scene in Stockholm and Berlin and so embarrassment was felt by many. What's happened across Camden is reflected by the running of this pub- fraudulent, pantomine youth cultutre, pretend danger and very, very un rock and roll. Those who attend the pub regularly do not want change and are happy to stand gormlessly staring at the video screen as apposed to meeting interesting and varied customers who don�t 'dress to their approval' and hence dont gain entry/service. Some retorical or spitefull defence will spring up or even deletion of this review but the facts are if based on the ethics the Dev promotes Gary Newman, Gary Holton, Tim Burton and Marylyn Manson would turn in their graves if they were dead. Edger Alan Poe probably is spinning.
anonymous - 2 Aug 2007 03:08 |
see, told you all, its a pub for tourist and "sunday best" drinkers.
And I would suggest the canadian drinker frequents a few more boozers in london before posting that all the other pubs in our thriving metropolis are full of football shirted morons wanting a ruck.
I thought the point of the "alternative" scene was to look beyond stereotypes, encourage pluralism and be accepting of each other?
It appears that once the goths get a bit of power in a pub they are just as mindless, biased and unwelcoming as those "normals" they seem to detest for displaying exactly the same traits.
And when the Dev is turned into a Bar One or a block of flats for "media types" they will all blame us "normals" as being to blame for the continuing homogenisation of "alternative London" , rather than seeing that they have been the architects of their demise.
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Being a member of the gothic community in Canada, I have to honestly say that the Dev is a breath of fresh air when it comes to the "club scene". My wife and I were lucky enough to literally stumble upon this wonderful pub while wandering the streets of Camden, and we felt completely at home in the surroundings. You have no idea how nice it felt to be in a place that felt accepting without pretense. An added plus was that we could actually sit and speak in a normal speaking voice without having to lean into each other's ears and shout at the top of our voices to be heard.
Now, as to the dress code... Bravo!
I can't stress this enough.
Frankly, if the football shirted drunken bozos that frequent every other pub in London aren't happy that they aren't desired or wanted in a place like the Dev, that's their problem.
The fact is, were someone of the gothic persuasion to enter a "footballer" pub, it would be nothing but stress, grief and bullshit from the drunks. Now, when I saw the "normals" enter the Dev, they were asked VERY politely to either don something black, or feel free to come back when more properly attired.
Likeliness is, were the situation reversed, it wouldn't be a polite request, it would likely be abuse leading to drunken violence and stupidity.
The football hooligans and idiots in the crowd won't like this, but that's because the truth is often difficult to swallow/admit/deal with.
For what it's worth, this Canadian goth and his wife will be back as often as possible.
Bravo to the Devonshire Arms for sticking to it's principles!!!!
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Psychonaut, yes, I am very well aware of why the pub has this rule, my point is that you should not be shocked if its daft "any colour as long as its black" policy results in its downfall.
In my opinion a lot of this thread appears to be a lot of whining from a bunch of middle class fantasists , oops I mean radical free thinkers, who shun the "identikit" world I apparently live in by frequenting boozers where everyone has to dress the same. Up the revolution indeed!
I am all for alternative haunts but feel it is a shame that goths cant be a bit more creative in keeping out trouble. Other pubs cope with letting in "normals" why cant you lot be a bit more selective?
Maybe its time for The Devonshire Arms and goths in general to stop playing the role of a victim. The blacks did it, the Irish did it, the gays did it, come on goths you can do it as well!
As for "chavs" and "football tops" causing trouble in "my normal pubs", please let me know which of "my" pubs you are having trouble in.
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Eskimojoe, Camden's alternative scene is being forced out, rather than 'sold off', by greedy property developers who want to turn Camden into another identikit town (should suit you, I think)
The dress code helps to maintain the atmosphere in The Dev - which is as an alternative pub. Don't want football tops and/or chavs spilling in for a fight or to intimidate the customers - which may happen if some of us venture into your 'normal' pubs.
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The dress code is an absolute joke and will be the death of the pub. I am afraid that time has indeed moved on and drinking establishments can't afford to pander to lightweight tourists in their "sunday bests"
It is ironic that none on this thread have made the link between Camden's alternative scene being sold off occuring as paying customers are being turned away or made to feel unwelcome from such establishments.
Discrimination is always wrong and there are much better ways to deal with trouble makers - every other pub has to deal with them so would suggest an alternative policy for the good of your Goth Utopia.
This pub receives my first and hpopefully last 0
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Not generally a fan of dress codes for bars but (at the risk sound sounding a hypocrite) its necessary here to preserve the atmosphere.
Good place and practically unique now. The spirit of Camden is terminally ill, but the Dev still lives on.
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My favourite watering hole. The Dev embodies Camden as it used to be, and in part still is. Apologies to 'anonymous' for the glares and funny looks: it can be a little cliquey i'm afraid. Try again, and this time get chatting to the staff or clientele while at the bar. To 'edgarbriggsmi5': how marvellous that in the same two lines you call the regular customers children, and have a temper tantrum. Has it occurred to you to wonder how the Dev stays 'chav-free'? Or would you enjoy Camden's Goth pub filling up with football shirts and baseball caps (word to the wise - buy a black jumper ;) )
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I'm a metal head and have never had any problems getting in because I love PVC and ware it most weekends, however I am sorry to say that the cliantelle suck. All is I got when I walked in was glares and funny looks. There again that must just be the sorthern way of a "welcome", you wouldn't catch anyone behaving like that in Sin City in Manchester.
anonymous - 21 Aug 2006 13:56 |
Great pub. All my friends are too scared to go in there.
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cliquey scumbags.....Get to the bar and get told -sorry we can't serve you,you need to wear alternative clothing....(had to wear a jumper to get through the rain to the pub-you muppet)!!.....I was going to goth gigs when these prats were still smiling sweetly & showing off there milk teeth to the school camera.
...0/10 -and lucky to get that.
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Great Pub. Good atmos. NO TVs which is brilliant. Never had a problem getting in and I am not that Gothy, more "alternative". Would like to see some better ales, but on the whole a good pint is served.
A nice place to go after a days shopping in the market or before one of the Electric Ballroom club nights.
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haven't been here in a while now, dont work up in camden anymore, but this was always my refuge from the outside world, I was never especially gothy; growing up with the punks kind of sorted that out for me, but after finishing a long hard day of holding a bloody sign on the high street it was nice to have a pentagram drawn in my guinness.
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A pint of your finest blood please.......
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People need to get over the whole dress code thing.
I went there on several ocasions... usually in jeans, trainers and a band t-shirt that may have been "alternative" but not Goth (i.e. The Smiths, AFI, The Misfits, Slayer, etc.)- I figure my longhair and usually being with a genuine goth or two helped... but the worst I ever got was a friendly "I'm sorry, but you'll have to take that off to come in" when I was wearing my warm jacket that has Adidas-like stripes (but isn't Adidas) on it and when I did, I was allowed entry. I was also given a friendly "Well, we'll admit this year, but next time you'll have to do better" for my half-arsed costume on Halloween.
I don't think you can judge a whole pub on a bouncer's mood on one occasion (i.e. only one factor), the dresscode seemed pretty loose to me.
Even though I'm not a goth, I enjoyed the genuine goth atmosphere and the music crossed genres a bit (I remember hearing Ministry and Razed in Black to go along with Bauhaus and Fields of the Nephilim). I also really enjoyed the late licence.
I did feel very hesitant about going here with any non-goth friends... but it's nice to have a (rare) place for goths to not worry about being harrassed (although people do seem much more open-minded in London than in the States, generally).
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A fantastic goth boozer. If only there were more of it's kind. A breath of fresh air from chavs filth, estate trash, and brain dead football watching, drooling zombies. All hail the Dev!
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I am far from a goth (mixed race metalhead with a blue denim patch jacket) but I've never had any hassle getting in the Dev! It's great getting pissed without being surrounded by turds in suits or football shirts, my only complaint is the lack of real ale, at least the snakebite is decent though. Somewhere to you can go for a late drink without having to pay to get in, being ripped off at the bar or being surrounded by trendy shitestains - hurrah for the Dev!!
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I can't think of anything better than "a pub where every one dresses the same, likes the same music, is the same age". It means you can go in there and you're guaranteed to have something in common with everyone in there, meaning you can pretty much talk to anyone knowing they'll be on the same wavelength as you are, enjoy the same music, go to the same clubs etc.
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Well life's too short to waste time arguing so we'll just have to agree to disagree.Have walked past the Devonshire about five times in the last few weeks and it has had about three people in it while all the surrounding pubs have been quite lively.I honestly can't think of anything worse than a pub where every one dresses the same,likes the same music,is the same age etc.and Iwould have thought anyone interested in starting fights would love a place that won't even serve them.Might buy my own pub one day and only let bald old gits like me in.
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Gel, your labelling us as 'clowns' is precisely why it's a good idea for you not to be served here.
The Dev is an alternative pub...get over it. It's a place where people like myself can go and relax without having to be exposed to drivel through the speakers, football, and polo shirt wearing prats. The dress code was introduced because in the past there was a bit of trouble with unsavoury elements in Camden, i.e. pickpockets, druggie, and also with chavvy types coming in who'd leer at the women and try to pick fights. The dress code filters out these elements.
There was some scheme recently to try and convert The Dev into a soulless wine bar, but several well organised nights are filling the tills and keeping our Dev alive.
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Exactly my point.We have pubs for all those things not just one of them.What are you clowns frightened of?
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** so things move on, its now a goth pub, get over it**
We have pubs for eating, meeting, getting p****d, straights and gays, and in the new century for goths..
Its called a sign of the times! MOVE ON STOP WHINGING
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Went in the Devonshire on sunday for the first time in quite a few years and was told I wouldn't be served because I wasn't a "goth". I thought something was wrong because I'd never seen the place empty on a sunday lunchtime before.What makes Camden so great and indeed London so great is diversity and this kind of small minded fascism has no place here.It doesn't seem long ago that shane and the pogues were leading sing songs at the bar and the place was full of people of all ages from all walks of life.Tragic.
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Used to drink in here quite regularly.
Been popping in infrequently on and off for a few months with my house mates as I have moved back to Camden and they are quite heavily into the scene.
Went in the other day with a friend who was wearing blue jeans and t-shirt, not a problem.
I on the other hand despite being in black was refused. "Its not the colour...its more the style"
Been in/around the scene for more years than I care to remember so I should have a fair idea of "the style".
Guess the guy just didn't like my face.
Everyone in the house is now boycotting the place and I won't ever go back again.
anonymous - 4 Aug 2005 11:09 |
I used to drink in this pub years ago - it was a friendly place to go with excellent bar staff/dj (when I looked more gothy). I went in about 6 months ago with my boyfriend who had a Fred Perry top and blue jeans on. The DJ stamped everyone else in the pub to come back that night and left us out presumably coz we weren't goth enough. Last weekend my mates came down from Newcastle. The guy has longer hair than most people (down past his arse) and his girlfriend had trainers, blue jeans on. By the time it got to 7pm they were asked to leave because they weren't wearing the dress code. So come on Devi, sort it out. Does it matter what people look like as long as they appreciate the music! Aren't dress codes for places like Bar One?
anonymous - 3 Aug 2005 19:47 |
Have been drinking here on and off for years. I don't need to mention what a well run and beautifully decorated pub this is, beer has always tasted good, music has always been great but reading some of these comments on the Devonshire have amused me really.
How many people have stated that you must wear black? As far as I am aware, there is no "colour code." I work in a pub myself and I am sick and tired of hearing idiotic complaints from people who "think" they are not welcome just because they are not wearing black?!
Was here on Wednesday afternoon (day before the bombings) with a friend of mine whom I'd not seen for years and I suggested we went to the Devonshire. I had a nice pint and we were the only customers there which was really nice I think as there's plenty to look at here (fab acrylic paintings on the mirrors, tables etc.. Rob, you are an artist!) hence my friend loved it too and she will be returning.
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Having read all the "you must be a registered goth" comments about this pub, we went there with some measure of 40-something exposure angst - would our sort-of-darkish attire not be Bela Lugosi enough for the strict Kurgan-lookalike (anyone remember highlander?) we expected at the door? Would they quiz us on obscure sisterhood lyrics, see how many gothic "dave's" we could rattle off in 10 seconds (ahem, dave gahan(?), dave vanian, dave sylvian, er, ah, ... stuck! OUT with you, miserable charlatan!). Did I mention Lorna's pinkish-orange trainers/sneakers..? Clearly, we were doomed - I could feel the soil falling over my head..... buzzzzzz! Not a gothic quote! OUT again!
Well, all the worry for naught - and I even sent bright-footed lorna in first, displaying perfect gothic timidness. A lovely, friendly place where the barman drew a pentagram in lieu of a clover [a nice touch i thought] in the foam on my guiness, and upon Lorna's request(the little trouble girl!**) scrabbled around to find anything by Japan to play for us. Successfully too. So, we got drunk, smoked a few ciggies (the lipstick on my cigarette, frost upon the windowpane ... ok, I'll stop soon) and had fun - i guess, mostly, since we played along, and they were more than nice, and because we liked their music (not just our requests)... but if they'd tossed us out i would have been somewhat irritated. In summary - in transylvania, do as the neophytes do... or just go to the brondes age for a pint of fosters with yer rugby jersey on - something i do quite regularly - ok, minus the jersey. Can't stand the game.
** sonic youth, instrumental ... one of their melodic ones.
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I find it annoying that people have complained about the dress code. Goths like myself cannot go dressed to any "normal" pub with a dress code and there are WAY more of them than places where the dress code is gothic ware. If people don't like it they can always find another pub and leave us in peace!
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A local pub for local goths!
A great pub, but as has been mentioned to death here (pun intended), you'll have trouble getting in unless you look the part or you're a regular.
Definitely a must see if you're of an alternative persuasion though. If you're not, you probably won't like it and probably won't get in!
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Cheer up, Goths!
anonymous - 31 Mar 2005 11:47 |
Did you know - I'm the only goth in the village !
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Some people seem to forget that this is a Goth/alternative pub. So please don't whine if you can't get in wearing streetwear. The dress code is there for a reason...
Personally, as a Goth, I love this place. It's a nice place to relax of an evening. There's good music, company, and the staff are nice and deserve a lot of credit for giving us such a pleasant haven.
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Good pub! shame you have to dress a certain way to get into it though!
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Yes - hard to believe I couldn't get in on a Wednesday evening because I wasn't goth enough. Ridiculous, wasn't exactly full. Used to be good until that happened. Like the music they had in here, shouldn't mean you have to dress as a goth to gain access. I don't really care how people dress.
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I love it here. It's really cosey and sexy.
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This pub, along with the Elephants Head, The Stag (now demolished) and The Constitution were a staple Camden pub crawl on a Saturday afternoon/Evening. Each belongs within its own universe. The Devonshire Arms is not as Goth as some I've seen and certainly was relaxed about dress code (last time I was there was Jan 2004). All that was required was to wear all black. I'm not a Goth, Moth, Sloth or any other stray that's wandered off a Mad Max set, but I still liked the friendly atmosphere in this pub. Beer is limited but the Guinness was good. The music was rather predestrian for Satans children. I was expecting to hear Cannibal Corpse or the like with Goths whipping each other with cat o nines, in between Bloody Mary's and Campari and petrol...but hey, this was Camden Town, not the dark backwaters of the Forest of Dean during Summer Solstice. No sacrificial virgins within sight, damn! Anyway, if you want an easy, friendly, darkish place to ponder existential angst, then this is the place for you.
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They get some real dim bouncers on the door enforcing the dress policy here. Unless you look like a stereotypical goth who's just landed from Transylvania, you may get them questioning you or just plain refusing you entry. My girlfriend was once wearing clothes covered in skulls, and has dyed-flame red hair, and creepers on, and this was somehow not good enough because there was also a pink cardigan. Ok, so maybe it is a bit more suitable attire for the nearby Elephant's Head, but Jesus. Luckily the Brandon Lee/Crow looking fella that works here was hovering nearby and he overruled the man's impeccable judgement and let us in.
Great pub though. I've slagged off the quality of the alcohol before, but have since discovered the excellent Scrumpy Jack. Don't know what it tastes so much better here - maybe the lines never get a chance to get dirty with all the snakebite consumed.
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Loved this pub......until i was refused entry on a weekend....for lack of black lipstick...invert snobbery at its best!
Ex goth (you know how hard black hair dye is to strip out) - 1 Nov 2004 18:40 |
I think that the dev is an absolutly great pub. I live in a pretty crappy area and good pubs are hard to find! If you decide to walk into any pub (apart from the dev of course) as a goth your normaly harresed by groups of trendies and stupid little girls who clearly shouldn't be in the anyway, now i know that as a goth you really can't complain about people staring at you but you can complain when your constantly beaten and harrased for it.
It's nice to be able to go somewhere where there are like-minded people, with a similar taste in clothes and music. If you haven't ever been there then make sure you check it out.
Rachael - 22 Oct 2004 14:02 |
Hi! I'd just like to reply to the comment bellow. It's not really snobbish reasons that the Dev has a dress code. It's more the fact that certain 'casuals' go to goth clubs/pubs specifically to cause trouble with the regular customers. It's a place 'alternatives' and 'goths' can go without feeling harassed.
Julia - 20 Oct 2004 16:19 |
I've not been to this pub for a while but have always liked it. They won't serve me now because I don't meet their dress code.
How ironic that the goths have turned into establishment snobs.
To any goth who says they get badly treated elsewhere, I say two wrongs don't make a right.
One day we will have a tolerant world and places like this will not be able to discriminate against people because of how they dress.
Tony - 8 Oct 2004 10:49 |
Last time i was in the Dev there was an extremely weird looking man aged about 60 covered in piercings and a woman with a crystal ball. These sort of characters are brilliant. After the disgraceful way the Hawley Arms was killed this is now the only pub in Camden worth a visit. Carls comment that it is the only pub he has ever been thrown out of for dressing too smart is the ultimate recommendation. Top pub.
Peter - 3 Sep 2004 16:24 |
Gothic, that's the only thing you need to know about the place. And it's not phoney gothic like that ridiculous Ben Crouch place in the west end.
A lot of people will be scared by the people and music in here, but they'll probably be just as scared of your white trainers. Me, I was just happy to hear some Pop Will Eat Itself.
The beer is near-undrinkable. But people don't come here to be beer connoisseurs.
And there's usually some tremendously drunk continentals to be found asleep at the bar.
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Elsie, I wear all kinds of diffrent colours and have always been let in to the Dev. It dosn't matter if you're not wearing black (there are plenty of goths who wear really bright colours!) but it DOES matter if you're not in some form of 'alternative' clothing. the dev is an alternative pub so they have a dress code, same as another bar/pub might have a no trainers policy. I've been to a couple of 'normal' pubs and had verbal abuse and unwanted comments by the other customers, the Dev is a place where people who like to dress a bit diffrently can have a pint without being bothered.
We're a happy bunch too ;)
Julia - 29 Jun 2004 15:01 |
my friend got done over by the bouncer for taking speed in the toilet, but i think that is a positive a zero tolerence zone.
look out for the little psssshd man with long hair and a good collection of hats, he will always buy you a beer and adds to the character of the pub!!!
lots of people have cool handles in there, remember a couple of names of guys called wedge and skord.not their real names but a damn site more interesting that the average name you get like phil or andy or fred!! the cider and black is good in here and the music is ok.bouncers can be dicks though ,turned away for having a white stripe on my trackie bottoms a while back!!! but there you go doorstaff think they run most pubs!
benny g belshaw - 27 Apr 2004 13:36 |
I have been going there for about three years now, and I have met some very artistic, interesting,and intellectual,people from all over the world, and enjoyed every last minuet of it.
So you have to dress in black, "good idea" that's part of the establishment, a foundation that helps intergrate the people, into a certain kind of unity.
The DEV has it's very own unique Originality, of which it is hard to find these days, "unlike" certain other "Let's try to be" Gothic pubs complete with a manufactured atmosphere.
As for the entry times, well "put it this way" Gen and Rob have enough on their plate, "as in" it's bloody hard work running a pub, "especially" in Camden.
So my assumption would be, "that"
one has to adopt a certain amount of assertiveness, when running such an establishment, it is therefore 'essential' to have a positive uncorruptible set of rules in order for it to remain a stable business, and a fun place to be.
As for the Landlady she works so bloody hard to keep us all happy she should change her name from Gen to Gem, because that's what she is a little Diamond, "although" she could get some REAL ALE in stock, for us older folk to sup.
So there you go THE REAL DEV !!!
Bryan - 5 Apr 2004 17:54 |
only pub i have ever been kicked out of!for being dressed to smart!those weirdos can keep their poxy pub.
carl - 7 Mar 2004 12:44 |
Beware if you like to wear any colour other than black - you won't get in. Sorry, I'm far too happy to go to a place like this.
Elise - 4 Mar 2004 00:43 |
I must admit i have gained a few funny looks walking in there. I am a short black guy and not to many of us are found in goth pubs. last time i went in there i was wearing a name brand jacket (it was cold ok!) but upon taking it off i saw some genuinely confused faces and some head scratching. One flaw the Dev has s it doesnt chill the aftershock which is a big no no. and the toilets are a bit lame but all in all a great plce.
Sonne - 24 Feb 2004 10:37 |
Something I like about this place is it's a genuine gothic pub and not a theme pub like the Eerie Pub Co. Chain Pubs, etc.
Carly - 28 Jan 2004 17:46 |
Great place to pop in for a pint on a saturday afternoon before it gets too busy. probably not everyone's cup of tea (or absinthe), and there can be a bit of an arrogant attitude among some of the goths at times, but as long as i get a table and am left alone, i don't really care!
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These are the sort of pubs i like to go to and will choose these every time over a trendy pub only problem is the first and last time i tried to get in the doormen wouldn't let me in 'cause i wasn't wearing black (so i'm not a goth so what) and it wasn't the dress code (i was wearing dark grey combats and t-shirt) since when did pubs like this have a dress code? we only wanted a couple of drinks before going to the Ballroom!!
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The Wings Of The Night;- the Devonshire Arms is the only haunt in London which has not buried gothic dead. The traditional Tudorian-style building in itself, combined with the spiritually diverse interior decor entices one to venture inside. The Devonshire Arms maintains the essence of a gothical atmosphere, peaceful and welcoming, with an interesting and varied blend of music. A dark haven for those who wish to escape the hustle and harrassment of most other pubs, and be able to feel safe with oneself in a truly gothic environment.
carly - 3 Dec 2003 05:55 |
Given the crap the Dev's management have gone through over the past six months trying to re-instate the hour before closing time entry on the licence, it's no wonder they stick so close to the last entry times. I understand it's frustrating not being able to come in after midnight on Friday's and Saturdays, 11pm on Sunday's, but it's not a case of them "Sucking the establishment's cock" but more one of them trying to stay open, and allow you entry, as late as possible. The simplest thing would be rather than you whinging on about how "alternative" sticking to the licence agreement is, you turn up BEFORE the bloody doors close! It would save both you and the doorstaff pointless arguments over how many minutes past the hour it is. And yes, I do work at The Dev as part of the security team. Love and Kisses, see you soon! xx
Ray - 29 Oct 2003 15:39 |
Great pub. Music tends to vary nicely between trad and more up to date stuff. I wouldnt drink in another pub in the area. True goth. Thanks.
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A) The points about the staff's attitude are true.
See 'Robin''s comment above - he works there/manages/owns it! "Apparantly they now have their own website" What, you didn't know for sure? Not very honest eh?
B) I have been turned away at 23:06 hrs (last doors 23:00) when because they were scared to lose their licence - who's going to tell the magistrate about 6 minutes F.F.S.? They were far from full, too! VERY ALTERNATIVE -sucking the establishment's cock or what? I'm sorry (barely) but this is the kind of thing that hinders a scene rather than makes it...anyone can put decor in their pub but more intangible things can be more difficult, no?
w4nk4h - 24 Oct 2003 17:04 |
Excellent Goth pub. In fact it is the only pub in london dedicated to the goth community! And its run by real goths, plus it is NOT a theme pub for tourists like the Eerie Pub Co pubs. Apparantly they now have their own website at devcamden.co.uk
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I like this place, mainly because I don't get any hassle from drunk wide boys like i would if i wandered into a typical "drones" pub.
The music is quite good, and some of the live bands have been pretty cool.
Smelly goths? maybe the odd one or two, but i'd rather have their company than builders in their dirty works clothes and city yobs in b.o. riddled suits.
cmcewan - 8 Aug 2003 12:45 |
Used to be a good goth haunt to hang around before Slimelight, Gossips or the Ballroom, with DJs and live bands. Now still gloomy and a reasonable meeting place, but not somewhere to hang around for long.
Flash Wilson - www.gorge.org - 31 Jul 2003 11:04 |
the dev is a nice pub with friendly staff. the music is much more eclectic and current than people think. especially when dj karmanaut is playing. he is the bollox and i'm sure he is destined for bigger things!
decklen - 19 Jul 2003 19:15 |
the dress code at the dev is only there to keep out beered up tossers, if they lose a few nice "normal" customers because of this then it's a price worth paying. any goth who has been hassled by a bunch of pissed lads will understand this.
anonymous - 19 Jul 2003 19:12 |
Despite having known us on the scene for many months, they refused us entry to flyer our own gig in the pub as we did not look 'goth' enough on that particular night. Needless to say we have pulled the gig.
anonymous - 8 Jul 2003 10:12 |
It could be really nice, but for the utterly rank beer and all the smelly goths
T - 27 Jun 2003 14:34 |
was a great experience this darkwave pub with best music & drinks. we visited with 12 friends from germany and we had a lot of fun. there you can meet nice people !
greetings from germany !
Andreas - 24 Jun 2003 11:35 |
Sometimes a pretentious shitehole, sometimes a grand evenin's drinking ... Extremes.
DaveK - 25 Apr 2003 15:34 |
I used to work @ the dev when i came to visit the UK from Australia and loved evey moment of it. the staff are great and the goths look fantastic, pity about some of thier attitudes though. great scenery.thnx dave
al - 19 Apr 2003 03:57 |
I used to really like this pub, went off it completely after I met the staff, especially the landlady. The pubs only really attractive feature is the goth attraction, but why get it there when you can get it at the Ben Crouch? There are better goth pubs, and better pubs in Camden. It's really not worth it.
anonymous - 29 Mar 2003 13:06 |
Billed as 'Londons premier gothic venue' although people not wearing black are equally welcome. (Unless you're wearing a football shirt).
drzoon - 16 Feb 2003 20:33 |
Rivals Intrepid Fox as best Rock pub in town. Friendly staff and lots to look at.
anonymous - 12 Feb 2003 12:08 |
Goth-metal themed pub. The beer is dodgy lager (Fosters, Kronenbourg, Stella) and Guinness, but the atmosphere, staff and people are nice. Would be perfect if only they had any real ale!
David Gerard - 20 Jan 2003 01:19 |
